12:41 p.m.
Today I completed an assignment for IT in Linux. (We dont have any windoze
machines in the house). So I saved it in a format supposedly compatible with
Microsoft Office 2003, but...of course, microsoft's (lack of) support for
open document format has redered the rather hefty assignment useless to the
school. I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school should
cater for the people that are actually using some software that is
compatible with open formats available on the *nix platforms.
I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get some form of
open solution for the software made available to us. But I am interested to
hear your oppinions on this issue, and if its actually worth promoting.
A rather peed off,
Kris Douglas
Softdel Limited Hosting Services
Web: www.softdel.net
Mail: kris(a)softdel.net
1:10 p.m.
I agree with you a open source solution should be used but It's just not
happening where I work they are stuck with old windows nt based solutions
and the company pay a lot of money for support. they could move over to a
open source solution and cut their IT bills in half. I guess it's a case of
schools/places of employment just doing what they always have and thats
support a microsoft regime.
~Jon
On 9/10/07, Kris Douglas <webbox.uk(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Today I completed an assignment for IT in Linux. (We dont have any windoze
machines in the house). So I saved it in a format supposedly compatible with
Microsoft Office 2003, but...of course, microsoft's (lack of) support for
open document format has redered the rather hefty assignment useless to the
school. I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school should
cater for the people that are actually using some software that is
compatible with open formats available on the *nix platforms.
I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get some form of
open solution for the software made available to us. But I am interested to
hear your oppinions on this issue, and if its actually worth promoting.
A rather peed off,
Kris Douglas
Softdel Limited Hosting Services
Web: www.softdel.net
Mail: kris(a)softdel.net
_______________________________________________
Staffslug mailing list
Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
2:54 p.m.
Sadly it's not quite as easy as asking the school to support an open
standard. Most school IT policy is formulated by a bunch of suits
that form a section of the LEA (Local Education Authority). It's
these guys that need to learn the lesson. The trouble is deals get
made. I'm not talking shady, under the counter stuff here just basic
"buy these PC's and this server and we'll throw in X copies of Win
XP/Vista together with X amount of copies of MS Office." This is
money men not IT professionals, all they see is that they 'think' they
are getting a bargain and so they go for it. Tell them about Linux
and they think something is dodgy when you tell them it is free.
The few schools that have some level of control of their IT budget are
often too scared to go down the open source route because the main IT
support tell them that they will not support anything other than MS
products....
--
==============================================
Kevan Farmer
Linux user #373362
Staffordshire
4:31 p.m.
I work in IT support in a secondary school. Heads of ICT are reluctant to go
down the road of having Linux based systems because of a percieved (probably
correctly) lack of people out there who can support it. I've managed to
persuade our head of faculty to let me set lose some Linux servers here but
in fairness there are not so many barriers to putting open source apps that
run on Windows into the network. We are going to put GNUCash on soon now
it's officially ported to Windows. I see no technical barrier to OpenOffice
going into schools both in curriculum and administrative systems.
Hope it happens widely.
On 10/09/2007, Kevanf1 <kevanf1(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Sadly it's not quite as easy as asking the school to support an open
standard. Most school IT policy is formulated by a bunch of suits
that form a section of the LEA (Local Education Authority). It's
these guys that need to learn the lesson. The trouble is deals get
made. I'm not talking shady, under the counter stuff here just basic
"buy these PC's and this server and we'll throw in X copies of Win
XP/Vista together with X amount of copies of MS Office." This is
money men not IT professionals, all they see is that they 'think' they
are getting a bargain and so they go for it. Tell them about Linux
and they think something is dodgy when you tell them it is free.
The few schools that have some level of control of their IT budget are
often too scared to go down the open source route because the main IT
support tell them that they will not support anything other than MS
products....
--
==============================================
Kevan Farmer
Linux user #373362
Staffordshire
_______________________________________________
Staffslug mailing list
Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
4:38 p.m.
It has to be an editable format, and though pdf's can be ripped...it
wouldn't be appropriate. I am going to see if I can point them in the right
direction, the old technician was a good friend of mine, and we installed an
old version of ubuntu on quite a few machines for messing about... But he
left to work back in Canada...so I'm pretty screwed, the new guys are a bit
narrow minded, so to speak.
On 10/09/2007, Chris Snow <cr.snow(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I work in IT support in a secondary school. Heads of ICT are reluctant to
go down the road of having Linux based systems because of a percieved
(probably correctly) lack of people out there who can support it. I've
managed to persuade our head of faculty to let me set lose some Linux
servers here but in fairness there are not so many barriers to putting open
source apps that run on Windows into the network. We are going to put
GNUCash on soon now it's officially ported to Windows. I see no technical
barrier to OpenOffice going into schools both in curriculum and
administrative systems.
Hope it happens widely.
On 10/09/2007, Kevanf1 <kevanf1(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Sadly it's not quite as easy as asking the school to support an open
> standard. Most school IT policy is formulated by a bunch of suits
> that form a section of the LEA (Local Education Authority). It's
> these guys that need to learn the lesson. The trouble is deals get
> made. I'm not talking shady, under the counter stuff here just basic
> "buy these PC's and this server and we'll throw in X copies of Win
> XP/Vista together with X amount of copies of MS Office." This is
> money men not IT professionals, all they see is that they 'think' they
> are getting a bargain and so they go for it. Tell them about Linux
> and they think something is dodgy when you tell them it is free.
>
> The few schools that have some level of control of their IT budget are
> often too scared to go down the open source route because the main IT
> support tell them that they will not support anything other than MS
> products....
> --
> ==============================================
>
> Kevan Farmer
> Linux user #373362
> Staffordshire
>
> _______________________________________________
> Staffslug mailing list
> Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
> http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
>
_______________________________________________
Staffslug mailing list
Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
--
Kris Douglas
Softdel Limited Hosting Services
Web: www.softdel.net
Mail: kris(a)softdel.net
5:58 p.m.
On 10/09/2007, Kris Douglas <webbox.uk(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Today I completed an assignment for IT in Linux.
Excellent, my girls do exactly the same, write it in oOo open it at school
in MS Office.
(We dont have any windoze machines in the house). So I saved it in a format
> supposedly compatible with Microsoft Office 2003, but...of course,
> microsoft's (lack of) support for open document format has redered the
> rather hefty assignment useless to the school.
Whoa hang on Kris lets be honest here, MS Office was around long before oOo
while I agree it would be nice for Mr Gates to include support for oOo in
his product I doubt he will seeing as that would lose him money. IMV its for
oOo to improve their compatibility with MS Office and not the other way
round. Don't get me wrong I'm not defending MS or anything but I prefer fact
to fiction and the fact is its oOo that's at fault here not MS. oOo is
notorious for being cumbersome, bloated and not too hot with compatibility.
Lets not cover up OSS failures by using the fog of MS insults to cloud whats
really going on.
I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school should cater for
> the people that are actually using some software that is compatible with
> open formats available on the *nix platforms.
I agree and this has been discussed over and over again, actually Sneyd
school, Bloxwich is starting to change, at the end of last term the IT
teacher was handing out oOo on cd's, Firefox has been installed on one or
two machine along with one or two other OSS apps such as Dia.
I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get some form of
> open solution for the software made available to us. But I am interested to
> hear your oppinions on this issue, and if its actually worth promoting.
Yes it is, just remember you are promoting an alternative that will have
incompatibilities and missing features compared to the product they have
used for at least the last 10+ years.
A rather peed off,
dick_turpin hands Kris a large bar of chocy :-)
--
Regards
Dick Turpin
Arch Linux is an independent i686-optimized community distribution for
intermediate and advanced Linux users. Utilising a Rolling Release System
packages are regularly updated and an ISO release is just a snapshot to the
stable packages at that time. So there's no need for a fresh install the
command 'pacman –Syu' upgrades the whole system.
6:24 p.m.
Haha, nice post DT. I think you are right in some respects. But the fact
they restrict opening this file for some reason that is the problem. I seem
to be able to open it in the office, but not at school...this is because of
their paranoid network configuration, no doubt. I spent a lot of time
messing with their servers to get some more functionality out of the system,
(RM suck at that)
On 10/09/2007, ArchLinuxUser dick_turpin <dick_turpin(a)archlinux.us> wrote:
On 10/09/2007, Kris Douglas <webbox.uk(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Today I completed an assignment for IT in Linux.
>
Excellent, my girls do exactly the same, write it in oOo open it at school
in MS Office.
(We dont have any windoze machines in the house). So I saved it in a
> format supposedly compatible with Microsoft Office 2003, but...of course,
> microsoft's (lack of) support for open document format has redered the
> rather hefty assignment useless to the school.
>
Whoa hang on Kris lets be honest here, MS Office was around long before
oOo while I agree it would be nice for Mr Gates to include support for oOo
in his product I doubt he will seeing as that would lose him money. IMV its
for oOo to improve their compatibility with MS Office and not the other way
round. Don't get me wrong I'm not defending MS or anything but I prefer fact
to fiction and the fact is its oOo that's at fault here not MS. oOo is
notorious for being cumbersome, bloated and not too hot with compatibility.
Lets not cover up OSS failures by using the fog of MS insults to cloud whats
really going on.
I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school should cater
> for the people that are actually using some software that is compatible with
> open formats available on the *nix platforms.
>
I agree and this has been discussed over and over again, actually Sneyd
school, Bloxwich is starting to change, at the end of last term the IT
teacher was handing out oOo on cd's, Firefox has been installed on one or
two machine along with one or two other OSS apps such as Dia.
I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get some form of
> open solution for the software made available to us. But I am interested to
> hear your oppinions on this issue, and if its actually worth promoting.
>
Yes it is, just remember you are promoting an alternative that will have
incompatibilities and missing features compared to the product they have
used for at least the last 10+ years.
A rather peed off,
>
dick_turpin hands Kris a large bar of chocy :-)
--
Regards
Dick Turpin
Arch Linux is an independent i686-optimized community distribution for
intermediate and advanced Linux users. Utilising a Rolling Release System
packages are regularly updated and an ISO release is just a snapshot to the
stable packages at that time. So there's no need for a fresh install the
command 'pacman –Syu' upgrades the whole system.
_______________________________________________
Staffslug mailing list
Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
--
Kris Douglas
Softdel Limited Hosting Services
Web: www.softdel.net
Mail: kris(a)softdel.net
6:41 p.m.
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 17:58 +0100, ArchLinuxUser dick_turpin wrote:
(We dont have any windoze machines in the house). So I saved
it in a format supposedly compatible with Microsoft Office
2003, but...of course, microsoft's (lack of) support for open
document format has redered the rather hefty assignment
useless to the school.
Whoa hang on Kris lets be honest here, MS Office was around long
before oOo while I agree it would be nice for Mr Gates to include
support for oOo in his product I doubt he will seeing as that would
lose him money. IMV its for oOo to improve their compatibility with MS
Office and not the other way round. Don't get me wrong I'm not
defending MS or anything but I prefer fact to fiction and the fact is
its oOo that's at fault here not MS. oOo is notorious for being
cumbersome, bloated and not too hot with compatibility. Lets not cover
up OSS failures by using the fog of MS insults to cloud whats really
going on.
While it would be good for them to have OpenOffice.org, they can
open ODF docs from Microsoft Office by installing Sun's plug-in:
http://www.sun.com/software/star/odf_plugin/
ODF is, after all, the agreed (ISO) international standard for
office data interchange, and .doc is a binay dump of the current
MS documant in RAM, hidden behind a culture of secret data
formats and lock-in :-/
I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school
should cater for the people that are actually using some
software that is compatible with open formats available on the
*nix platforms.
I agree and this has been discussed over and over again, actually
Sneyd school, Bloxwich is starting to change, at the end of last term
the IT teacher was handing out oOo on cd's, Firefox has been installed
on one or two machine along with one or two other OSS apps such as
Dia.
I hope everyone with contacts in education has informed them
about the Open Schools Alliance's Success In Education
event. We're holding it in Liverpool on 19 October.
http://www.openschoolsalliance.org/education-event
http://www.openschoolsalliance.org/education-event/itinerary/
I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get
some form of open solution for the software made available to
us. But I am interested to hear your oppinions on this issue,
and if its actually worth promoting.
Yes it is, just remember you are promoting an alternative that will have
incompatibilities and missing features compared to the product they have used for at least
the last 10+ years.
That applies to all upgrades of course - they will find more than
a few differences were they to change to Office 2007, rather more
changes in fact than if they went to OOo.
Regards,
- Richard
6:46 p.m.
Our school has only just jumped to MSO2k3. Used to be running 2k, which
worked FINE with all OOo stuffs.
On 10/09/2007, Richard Smedley <smedley358(a)btinternet.com> wrote:
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 17:58 +0100, ArchLinuxUser dick_turpin wrote:
> (We dont have any windoze machines in the house). So I saved
> it in a format supposedly compatible with Microsoft Office
> 2003, but...of course, microsoft's (lack of) support for open
> document format has redered the rather hefty assignment
> useless to the school.
>
> Whoa hang on Kris lets be honest here, MS Office was around long
> before oOo while I agree it would be nice for Mr Gates to include
> support for oOo in his product I doubt he will seeing as that would
> lose him money. IMV its for oOo to improve their compatibility with MS
> Office and not the other way round. Don't get me wrong I'm not
> defending MS or anything but I prefer fact to fiction and the fact is
> its oOo that's at fault here not MS. oOo is notorious for being
> cumbersome, bloated and not too hot with compatibility. Lets not cover
> up OSS failures by using the fog of MS insults to cloud whats really
> going on.
While it would be good for them to have OpenOffice.org, they can
open ODF docs from Microsoft Office by installing Sun's plug-in:
http://www.sun.com/software/star/odf_plugin/
ODF is, after all, the agreed (ISO) international standard for
office data interchange, and .doc is a binay dump of the current
MS documant in RAM, hidden behind a culture of secret data
formats and lock-in :-/
>
> I think this is a pile of animal's fecal matter, the school
> should cater for the people that are actually using some
> software that is compatible with open formats available on the
> *nix platforms.
>
> I agree and this has been discussed over and over again, actually
> Sneyd school, Bloxwich is starting to change, at the end of last term
> the IT teacher was handing out oOo on cd's, Firefox has been installed
> on one or two machine along with one or two other OSS apps such as
> Dia.
I hope everyone with contacts in education has informed them
about the Open Schools Alliance's Success In Education
event. We're holding it in Liverpool on 19 October.
http://www.openschoolsalliance.org/education-event
http://www.openschoolsalliance.org/education-event/itinerary/
> I intend to complain at my school today to see if I can get
> some form of open solution for the software made available to
> us. But I am interested to hear your oppinions on this issue,
> and if its actually worth promoting.
>
> Yes it is, just remember you are promoting an alternative that will have
incompatibilities and missing features compared to the product they have
used for at least the last 10+ years.
That applies to all upgrades of course - they will find more than
a few differences were they to change to Office 2007, rather more
changes in fact than if they went to OOo.
Regards,
- Richard
_______________________________________________
Staffslug mailing list
Staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk
http://www.staffslug.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/staffslug
--
Kris Douglas
Softdel Limited Hosting Services
Web: www.softdel.net
Mail: kris(a)softdel.net
9:22 a.m.
On 10/09/2007, Kris Douglas <webbox.uk(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Haha, nice post DT. I think you are right in some respects. But the fact
they restrict opening this file for some reason that is the problem.
Just to nit pick ;-)
I doubt MS would restrict opening an oOo doc in Word ect more likely they
would just not support the format, they may well restrict opening a Word doc
in oOo now that would be typical MS policy.
I seem to be able to open it in the office, but not at school...this is
because of their paranoid network configuration, no doubt.
Does you're school run that secure, school, learning environment software
thingy (Impressed with my technical description?) I did a night school
course at Walsall collage that had one I think it was Novell.
--
Regards
Dick Turpin
Arch Linux is an independent i686-optimized community distribution for
intermediate and advanced Linux users. Utilising a Rolling Release System
packages are regularly updated and an ISO release is just a snapshot to the
stable packages at that time. So there's no need for a fresh install the
command 'pacman –Syu' upgrades the whole system.
9:34 a.m.
On 10/09/2007, Richard Smedley <smedley358(a)btinternet.com> wrote:
While it would be good for them to have OpenOffice.org, they can
open ODF docs from Microsoft Office by installing Sun's plug-in:
http://www.sun.com/software/star/odf_plugin/
That sounds pretty good, most schools would be more willing to install sun
stuff over OSS although ideally we'd want cross compatibility rather than
having to install some 'bridging' software.
That applies to all upgrades of course - they will find more than
a few differences were they to change to Office 2007
Aaaarrgghh Don't. I thought I would be a smart arse and install 2007 at work
and at home. Its a pile of dog doo doo. everything is not where you'd expect
it, it takes 5 or 10 mins to find the feature you're after, oh and if you're
sending any docs as attachments make sure you've saved them in 2003 format.
You would have thought that Mr Gates would have twigged by now that he
should at least make 'Read-ability' backwards compatible.
--
Regards
Dick Turpin
Arch Linux is an independent i686-optimized community distribution for
intermediate and advanced Linux users. Utilising a Rolling Release System
packages are regularly updated and an ISO release is just a snapshot to the
stable packages at that time. So there's no need for a fresh install the
command 'pacman –Syu' upgrades the whole system.
12:12 p.m.
On 11/09/2007, ArchLinuxUser dick_turpin <dick_turpin(a)archlinux.us> wrote:
You would have thought that Mr Gates would have twigged by now that
he
should at least make 'Read-ability' backwards compatible.
Nah, that's to 'encourage' others to also upgrade to the latest
version. Forgetting that by doing that he is actually only
encouraging more piracy due to the ridiculous costs. Sadly not
everybody has heard of Open Office let alone Open Source :-(
--
==============================================
Kevan Farmer
Linux user #373362
Staffordshire
6082
days inactive
6083
days old
11 comments
6 participants
participants (6)
-
ArchLinuxUser dick_turpin -
Chris Snow -
Jonothon Nihill -
Kevanf1 -
Kris Douglas -
Richard Smedley