11:12 a.m.
p.s. Sorry to those on the trips@ mailing list for my test messages,
it'll make sense if you read this!
Lo All,
I've occasionally noticed that people who reply to messages I've sent
into one of the lists... are replying directly to me rather than the list.
I don't always spot it... but on those occasions where I have, I usually
let them know and they re-post their message on the list (various
people, not targeting anyone particular!).
I don't think people have intentionally sought to just reply to me... if
you were though, keep it on the lists where possible... it'll encourage
more use of them :)
I've managed to isolate at least 9 messages (let me know if you want a
list of them) that were probably meant for the mailing list but came to
me instead (which I never noticed at the time and were not resent by the
original sender)... so they've now been imported into the archives with
all the other messages. Mostly so these conversations now make sense if
you ever browse them online!
Where this has been accidental though I've been research the possible
reasons why...
*Short version: *Use a "Reply List" button (or similar name, if you have
one), but failing that... using the "Reply All" button should work too.
*---
*
*Long version... (read on... especially if you know about e-mail headers!)*
I don't seem to be affected by this as much due to a user interface
difference in my Thunderbird mail client. When I reply to messages,
I've instinctively always been been drawn to using the "Reply List"
button (which appears where the "Reply All" button would normally be)
next to the normal "Reply" button. Thunderbird seems to show this
button because it knows (due to the RFC2369 List-* headers) that it is a
mailing list.
If you don't use Thunderbird it'd be helpful to know if your mail client
does something similar, maybe people on Gmail may know if that does also?
This does mean though... that those who just hit "Reply" (likely having
no other choice, not even "Reply All") need to check if their mail
client filled in the "To:" field with the original senders e-mail
address or the list address, and manually change it if needed. But
generally I'd say these days most people at least have a "Reply All"
button which should work just as well.
I find in Thunderbird that if I use "Reply" and not "Reply List" that
it
always replies directly (and not via the list)... unless I'm replying to
myself via the list, then it realises you likely don't want to reply to
yourself and uses the list address instead!
Looking back (before the relaunch in August) when the old
staffslug(a)staffslug.org.uk mailing list ran on the older Mailman 2...
things (in terms of the From: address and headers, etc...) were set up
in exactly the same way as they are now. So not sure how much of an
issue it was back then, I never heard of it being a problem back then.
However looking at the way "Shropshire LUG" does it... incoming messages
from the mailing list show up as...
From: Steven Madox via Shropshire <shropshire(a)mailman.lug.org.uk>
Subject: [Shropshire] Whatever
To: shropshire(a)mailman.lug.org.uk
CC: s.maddox(a)lantizia.me.uk
So when hitting reply... it goes to the list, and instead the original
senders e-mail has been clumsily put into the CC section instead
(although they don't get two copies of the message) - mostly so you can
just see who really sent it.
Mailman 3 it seems (via the Postorious web UI) has a "Reply goes to
list" configuration setting, which although doesn't do what I've seen on
Shrops LUG - mangles things in other ways.
It has 4 choices (see this
<https://mailman.readthedocs.io/en/latest/src/mailman/handlers/docs/reply-...
bit of their docs, which strongly recommends you never touch it!)...
here they are along with my findings as to what they do...
* *No munging *(default)
/_When Tested:_/ Does exactly nothing, which is exactly the
intention in this case. Leaving the Reply-To header (if one exists)
alone. This does mean though people without RFC2369 compliant mail
clients (or just those without a 'Reply List' or 'Reply All' option)
need to type in the mailing list address manually in to "To:" field
(or copy it from the "To:" that can be found in the original message).
* *Reply goes to list*
/_When Tested:_/ If you're not using Thunderbird, this likely does
exactly what it's meant to, which is add a 'Reply-To' header so if
you hit "Reply" it'll go to the list. But it seems Thunderbird
changed something a while back to ignore the 'Reply-To' header when
using "Reply" if the message is considered to be from a mailing
list! I suppose because they really want you to use that 'Reply
List' button?
* _*Explicit Reply-to header set*_
/_When Tested:_/ This seems to add a completely empty 'Reply-To'
header, no idea why._*
*_
* _*Explicit Reply-to set; no Cc added*_*/_
_/*/_When Tested:_/ Seems to do exactly the same as the last one.
No idea why this one is 'no Cc added' as none of the above 3
starting adding in Cc's anyway!
The first option 'No munging' is the one that is strongly recommended by
the Mailman 3 team.
Anyone got any thoughts on this?
The more I wrote up this e-mail I find myself just wanting to leave it
as it is! Trust me this e-mail was going to be way longer :S
--
Steven Maddox
Lantizia